"Beware the Batman" News & Discussion Thread, Part 4 (Spoilers)

[ashleesmach1]

it's not on cartoon network has it been moved to Teletoon? and what channel is that?

 

[Greg91]

Teletoon is a kids channel in Canada. And yes, the new episode Attraction was, indeed, replaced with Hunted. (sigh). February 18th can't get here fast enough (for the DVD set). Ironically, that's the birthday of a friend of mine.

 

[KYO'NYUU IMOUTO]

Page 15 of this PDF claims that CG animation's average rate is $500,000-800,000 an episode. Looks like revenue streams aren't pulling in enough money to justify that cost.

 

[Pfeiffer-Pfan]

A shame, I really love this show.

They knew this from Green Lantern: The Animated Series and there was still no attempt on CN's part to properly promote it or even give it a decent timeslot.

Why on earth would they agree to a dark, serialized Batman show with few of his supporting characters or major villians, when the network has clearly been leaning towards wacky comedy in recent times. They cancel Batman: The Brave and the Bold which fits infinitely better into their current scheme yet greenlights one that doesn't service their broader goals at all.

- Expensive CG animation
- A FEMALE sidekick (we know how much they hate that)
- A strong serialized format
- A mature approach
- No recognizable villians

Coupled with:

- No real promotion
- A terrible timeslot
- No re-runs
- No real toyline/ merchandise

How did they think this was going to end? With alot of money in their pockets?

 

[TheVileOne]

I'm just speculating here, but I wonder if the theater shooting soured Cartoon Network on the show. Didn't it cause extensive changes to be made?

 

[Pfeiffer-Pfan]

I'm just speculating here, but I wonder if the theater shooting soured Cartoon Network on the show. Didn't it cause extensive changes to be made?

It's possible... but even with the changes, they still haven't supported the series. It seems the show was a lost cause in their eyes before it even premiered.

They threw out a few episodes to see if there was something there, but with average ratings and no merchandise to speak of, they are apparently cutting their losses.

It's just shocking that it's a Batman cartoon. I don't think any Batman venture has truly failed like this in 25 years.

 

[TheVileOne]

Batman & Robin came out less than 25 years ago .

Also Batman: Dark Tomorrow.

 

[Hordesman]

Batman & Robin came out less than 25 years ago . Also Batman: Dark Tomorrow.

Batman and Robin, iirc, wasn't so much a Bo disaster as something that didn't quite make the money they wanted and had pr issues. There were even talks about a fifth one coming off it. But I'm more interested in seeing what comes out of toyfair here

 

[Pfeiffer-Pfan]

Batman & Robin came out less than 25 years ago .

Also Batman: Dark Tomorrow.

I'll give you Batman: Dark Tomorrow.

But Batman & Robin actually turned a pretty decent profit for WB... then add in the merchanidse and home video sales and your looking at a relatively successful venture. Not as successful as the previous three movies but still.

 

[Sketch]

The manner in which Warner spends money to produce shows and then allows Cartoon Network to waste it is simply remarkable.

Is there no way they can force CN to give a crap? I felt they vastly under-supported Green Lantern: TAS but they did not even give Beware the Batman a chance.

If they need toys to make it profitable then why only one toy in the first year? There are certainly Batman toys on the shelf right now and Batman merchandise everywhere so why doesn't any of that help fund this show and if it does then why is that not satisfactory? If it was ratings they were after then they couldn't have done a much worse job at trying to get them.

On the other hand the market may finally be bored with Batman right now so let that be a lesson to Warner. How about trying a more affordable Superman cartoon next?

 

[TheVileOne]

Well isn't it technically Cartoon Network wasting the money? They are ordering the shows, are they not? Also, while I think more could've been done to promote these shows, if they fail to capture the imagination of children, is that also all Cartoon Network's fault? Maybe the shows needed to do more to be appealing to kids instead of adult comic fans.

 

[Sketch]

CN did order it but I would think Warner actually pays more to produce these shows than CN in the US spends on them, particularly since they will be sold in other markets around the world. If your argument is CN spent money and wasted it, then I completely agree. However, failing in America is going to make it that much more difficult to continue the series overseas if it proves more successful outside of the US and Warner is feeling that.

It's hard to determine if kids actually had a chance to like Beware the Batman. If it's only crime was losing to SpongeBob every week then it's no more a failure than most shows airing against SpongeBob.

Young Justice had fairly ample opportunity to hook kids and was reasonably well promoted and even Green Lantern got decent promo early on so I'm willing to believe kids at least knew they were airing. Kids certainly know TTG is airing. Beware the Batman could easily have gone unnoticed and that's not the show's fault alone so we'll never know for sure if kids didn't like this Batman or if they just didn't know it was on.

I'm pretty certain that if Cartoon Network had ran Beware on a low competition night like Tuesday as they did with TTG, the results would have been a lot more favorable and we'd at least know if kids liked it or not.

I'm surprised you'd blame the show when in the past you were so adamant that CN did not promote ThunderCats enough when it got quite a bit more promotion than Beware the Batman did. I feel quite the opposite that CN gave ThunderCats a good chance (at least at first) and they never gave such courtesy to Beware the Batman.

I'm really not mourning the loss of Beware the Batman, certainly not as much as the loss of GL:TAS or ThunderCats 2011 but it frustrates me that CN set this show up to fail. If that wasn't their intention then they sure did a lousy job at preventing that and after several other good action cartoon cancellations it's disturbing to see the trend continue, even for a show that I wasn't that interested in to begin with.

 

[TheVileOne]

CN did order it but I would think Warner actually pays more to produce these shows than CN in the US spends on them, particularly since they will be sold in other markets around the world. But if your argument is that CN spent and CN wasted then you're absolutely right but failing in the US market significantly lowers the possibility for the show to continue in foreign markets where it likely did better.

Isn't it all Time Warner at the end of the day?

It's hard to determine if kids actually had a chance to like Beware the Batman. If it's only crime was losing to SpongeBob every week then it's no more a failure than most shows airing against SpongeBob.

Considering that this is the Batman brand, than it is more of a failure than most shows against SpongeBob.

I'm surprised you'd blame the show when in the past you were so adamant that CN did not promote ThunderCats enough when it got quite a bit more promotion than Beware the Batman did. I feel quite the opposite that CN gave ThunderCats a good chance (at least at first) and they never gave such courtesy to Beware the Batman.

I stand by my statements that CN did a poor job of promoting and advertising Thundercats after the premiere. At the same time, it was their project. They greenlit the project. They funded the project. So the only reason we even had a new Thundercats animation in the first place was CN. Warner Bros. explored turning it into a movie. That never materialized. Also, the toyline was an abject failure. Kids didn't like the toys. But CN gave the toy license to Bandai USA and they made a terrible product, so i think that deserves some blame as well.

Also the reason I blame the show is because of firsthand evidence. At Comic-Con I attended the Beware the Batman panel. Kids were constantly asking questions about characters and things that weren't on the show. The creators for the show who were at the panel sounded downright depressed about being there. Glen Murakami might've been having a bad day, but he constantly refused to answer questions and acted like he did not want to be there that day. So if the creators aren't going to be enthusiastic about their product, why should kids and fans be?

Also from what I saw of the show, it just wasn't up to par compared to previous iterations of animated Batman. I didn't like the designs or CG animation. I didn't like the re-imagining of Alfred. While I understand what they were going for, I think it was a mistake to not utilize more well known Batman mythos characters. I think using new characters is fine, but the show could've used a stronger mix of new and old characters. I think making Katana the Robin character for the show was a misstep.

 

[Sketch]

Now that's an even better point about wasting Warner's money if it's all Time Warner in the end but they do operate separately from one another and that's part of the problem and has been for a while.

 

[Hero Supreme]

I have to imagine, or at least hope, they have a replacement series in the wings. I really don't feel I had a chance to like Beware the Batman. So far, I feel its okay, but its so early that I believe I could be won over by the end of the 26 episode run. Still, I would be at least as interested in a new series as I would in getting more of this. A Superman team up a la Brave and the Bold would be a good option. And please oh please, can it just be a traditionally animated series?

 

[trance2009]

Yeah, so they can cancel that one after 10 eps.

 

[KYO'NYUU IMOUTO]

Yeah, so they can cancel that one after 10 eps.

They ordered twenty-six episodes. They simply chose not to order episodes beyond their initial order. That doesn't quite count as 'canceling'.

 

[Yojimbo]

I have to imagine, or at least hope, they have a replacement series in the wings.

Undoubtedly. Like the DC Universe line having 3-5 movies in various stages of development at a time, I'm sure WBA has at least 3 shows also in various stages of development (i.e. 2 in active production and 1 in development-working towards a greenlight). That aside, we can sort of suss out a new Justice League show might have been of interest at one point. In that Voices From Krypton interview with Giancarlo Volpe, Volpe revealed he and Mike Ryan were developing a JL show with 13 episodes in mind but it fell through. Suffice to say, like the case of Green Lantern: TAS or Beware The Batman, the torch could have been passed to others to develop a JL show with a different direction.

I really don't feel I had a chance to like Beware the Batman. So far, I feel its okay, but its so early that I believe I could be won over by the end of the 26 episode run.

This is hard to conceptualize but I like the show. It's good. I'm entertained. It could use some improvements but that could happen in the second half. I post in the talkback threads. But a part of me won't let the other part fully fall in love with the show because of the distrust of CN. YJ and GL's premature end is still in recent memory and I'm real hesitant to really commit...

Still, I would be at least as interested in a new series as I would in getting more of this. A Superman team up a la Brave and the Bold would be a good option. And please oh please, can it just be a traditionally animated series?

Yeah. I and others have said for long time that Superman is long overdue for a new animated series. Someone at WBA must have an idea on how to crack that walnut and produce a cool show. But I guess it matters more for the person who tells Sam Register what show the network wants to have Superman on the brain.

EDIT: CN has February 1 up and still no Beware The Batman.

 

[Hordesman]

I dreamt it got renewed for two more seasons last night. Gonna see if I can dig up anything on London toyfair now...

 

[Aaron]

I'm really not mourning the loss of Beware the Batman, certainly not as much as the loss of GL:TAS or ThunderCats 2011 .

I'm with you on that one! GL:TAS and ThunderCats '11 should have never been given the axe. Those shows were fantastic. I wish they were still on the air. ESPECIALLY ThunderCats!

I'm not mourning the loss of BtB at all, really.
I tried and tried and TRIED to get into this show. But I just couldn't. I had no real gripes against the visuals and CGI. I actually liked the black/vinyl/shiny rubber look Batman's suit had, and after initially not liking the Bat-Ears, they slowly grew on me, reminding of the big ears on the original costume. I even got around to liking Shaved-head-Alfred. I actually LOVED the Batmobile right from the start. And I also enjoyed the voice-acting.

But the thing that bothered me was primarily the writing and the characters/characterization. I was fine with changing/shaking things up. Bring in new villains and characters! I was fine with bringing in Katana. I was NOT fine with bring her in instead of Robin. In addition to, sure, but in lieu of, no. But that's not was REALLY bothered me about her. What bothered me was how unbelievably boring she was. She was... just... so boring. I don't know how exactly to explain it, but she absolutely bored me to tears. The other characters were bothersome insofar as conception and writing are concerned. Why bother to introduce a new rogues gallery in a show, if you're just going to drastically alter the characters to the point where they're nothing like their comicbook counterparts?!
Professor Pyg, Mister Toad, Magpie, Anarky, Humpty Dumpty... just to name a few. They're so dramatically altered from their source material that if they had been introduced as all new characters with different names, I would have never known who they were based on. Heck, Anarky LOOKS nothing like himself and reminded me more of the Joker, with his quirky semi-insanity and wise-cracks.

But the biggest crime this show committed was this: It was boring. It was just boring. The ONE thing a Batman product should NEVER be. Boring. And it was. Oh boy was it ever. I actually fell asleep watching a few episodes, and had to go back and re-watch them.
This was the first Batman show I've actually disliked almost entirely, since 1977's The New Adventures of Batman. And the ONLY reason I stuck it out for that show was the voice cast. But yeesh, did I ever hate that show!

I hope a new Batman show comes along, in a few years (nothing immediately) that manages to captivate me the way B:TAS, The Batman, and B:TBaTB did.