Hulk: Can They Get It Right?

[StrangerAtaru]

Something sort of came to me recently that I was thinking about. While some heroes such as Spiderman and the X-Men (not to mention Batman, the TMNT, and several others at other studios) have one or two animated series that are either beloved by fans or "just get it right", the Hulk always seems to have a tough time being animated to the small screen. The first animated series back in the 1960's was pretty much a bunch of comic panels on the screen and giving them limited animation, unlike what Spiderman was getting. Then the next series, made in the 1980's, was layed with typical "cheese" (like the dialouge and some of the plots from what I hear) and other "mysteries" due to bad animation. (Banner's shirt for one) It only lasted one season compared to the more popular "Spiderman and His Amazing Friends". Then came the recent series, which while I liked, had many complain was either too convoluted or dark in the first season and was too stupified in one way or another in the second. And now we have this "Hulks" garbage possibly coming and....well basically, lets just say right now it could be a disaster waiting to happen.

So basically, what I want to know is why is it so hard to make a good Hulk series? (then again, the Hulk has had problems before, from the first comic series only lasting 6 issues to the low gross of the movie....heck the only long-term success that worked from ground zero and anyone remembers is the Bixby/Ferrigno series from the 1970's) Is the character that tough to make a decent series around? And, playing devil's advocate for a moment, how would you make a good Hulk series?

 

[Mister Intensity]

Have you seen the 1980's Hulk series? While it had its cheesy moments (and what 80's cartoon show didn't), it did capture the essence of what the Hulk is about. I think the big reason for its relative failure (note that NBC did rerun the series for about a year or two after its original run) was that it started airing only a few months after the end of the live-action series. With memories of that series so strong, an animated version that was more comics based than the live-action show is going to disappoint an audience that expected a show more like the live-action version. Also keep in mind that many Saturday Morning shows from that period didn't neccessarily have new episodes each season (which made the long runs of shows like Scooby-Doo, Smurfs, and Super Friends that much more impressive). Spider-Man and his Amazing Friends only had only four episodes in season two and six episodes in season three (I may be off by an episode or two).

As for what would make a good Hulk series, I thought that the 1982 series and the first season of the UPN series captured the essence of what the Hulk concept is about. I do wish they would move beyond the "Hulk Smash" phase of his life but then again, Spider-Man is always a college student in his various animated series.

Mister Intensity

 

[czyznyck99]

The first season of the UPN series is the closest that Marvel will ever get. Their niche now seems to be focusing new animated series from the movie adaptations, which at least have been somewhat consistent. All except for the Hulk, of course. Strange things are going to happen there if the animated Hulk ever returns. 15 feet tall? Probably not. David Banner returns as Absorbing Man? Better not.

Later.

 

[Jess Matthews]

Gonna have to agree with Mister Intensity here. While it does have cheese and elements made to youngen up the show for the target audience (i.e.: Doctor Banner's Amazing Regenerative Outfit), it was really well-done, well-animated, well-scored, and actually fairly well-written. It wasn't real serious but it was very fun and did a great job of getting the tragedy of the Hulk while balancing it with the more fun aspects of his persona. I actually think that in a lot of areas, it outclasses the first season of the UPN show.

As for the Hulk show, I do think they could make something good out of the movie concept, which I thought was pretty well-done. But then again, I really hope they don't go with the Hulk And Son thing that has been reported elsewhere...

 

[Spider-Friends]

...an animated version that was more comics based than the live-action show is going to disappoint an audience that expected a show more like the live-action version.

I think that's the whole problem with the Hulk. There have been so many different incarnations of the character that it is now IMPOSSIBLE to satisfy a large number of people. We all want something different. I think this was the reason many people were disappointed with the movie too.

I think the 80s show and the first season of the 90s show had the premise that I would prefer, but the 80s show is VERY dated and sort of boring...and I didn't think the 90s show was very well made, even at the time.

 

[Chris Wood]

I think the 80s show and the first season of the 90s show had the premise that I would prefer, but the 80s show is VERY dated and sort of boring....

Well, yes. The Hulk is just not as telegenic as other Marvel heroes. He doesn't make wisecracks, and he's almost always in the same grumpy mood. Inescapably one winds up with a fairly serious show, and the restraints of network TV have so far kept cartoon adaptations from really exploring the character's dark nature. Instead we get a rather bland middle of the road presentation.

 

[tony]

Well The sure as heck didn't get the new movie right and Hulk and Sons dosen't sound good

 

[Ssrn53]

I think the best Hulk cartoon so far is the 1982 version. It captured perfectly what was arguably the first and best version of the Hulk, the savage Hulk. During the late 80's many fans (including myself) stopped collecting the Hulk when they started making radical changes to his persona with Mr. Fixit and the green intelligent Hulk. Hulk is supposed to be savage brute and the exact opposite of the Bruce Banner persona. If that's changed he is no longer the Hulk. There is something wrong with seeing the Hulk dressed in a suit tie and speaking like he went to college. It doesn't work. Go to Imdb.com and search for the 1996 Hulk and read the reviews. The complaints are all the same. Besides She-Hulk ruining the 1996 series, it was also due to the grey Hulk. They want the Green savage Hulk and nothing else. In fact when I think of the Hulk I don't even the other incarnations.

The 1996 series might have lasted longer if they had just concentrated on the green Savage Hulk, Bruce Banner and his search for a cure, his relationship with Betty Ross, and General Ross and the Hulk Busters. Instead in season two they chose to focus on She-Hulk and the grey Hulk. Betty Ross was hardly in season two at all and there is no excuse for that. The writers seemed to think that the Hulk couldn't carry a cartoon by himself without She-Hulk even though he carried a successful comic series for close to forty years. Can She-Hulk say the same. Better luck next time incredible Hulk. Here's hoping they get it right next time. Till then I hope Hulk smashes Ang Lee for that mess of a movie. nuff said.

 

[Weibart]

it's a strange formula but many kids networks follow it: change the superhero into a teenaged one that kids can identify with. the only show that has done this successfully isn't animated, but liveacton: Smallville. there's a show that took that formula and made it work. is it because that show is live action that it worked. what if it was animated?
i don't think smallville would be as good in animated form.

i think kids would watch an animated teen hulk, but that's where the following will stay: the kids that watch the show. network could careless about the older audience, just as long as they bring the kid demographic in. i don't like this trend with animated superheros, but i think it'll continue. i don't want to see a boy hulk, it's just too hokey.

besides, would bruce banner want to pass on his curse to another generation. i think he would rather die than see his own offspring go through the same torment he's endured. so right there i'm turned off to the idea. i'm having problems with this show already. unless the government or some secret organization has created an offspring of him with his own dna and without him knowing. i hope they go that route and not banner and betty having a child and raising it together. that'd be way goofy. for this idea to work, this kid would have to be tormented and angry inside, like x23 feels toward wolverine. there'd have to be tension between father and son, not some happy relationship. well, maybe over time as the series progresses.

 

[Hypestyle]

it's a strange formula but many kids networks follow it: change the superhero into a teenaged one that kids can identify with. the only show that has done this successfully isn't animated, but liveacton: Smallville. there's a show that took that formula and made it work. is it because that show is live action that it worked. what if it was animated?
i don't think smallville would be as good in animated form.

i think kids would watch an animated teen hulk, but that's where the following will stay: the kids that watch the show. network could careless about the older audience, just as long as they bring the kid demographic in. i don't like this trend with animated superheros, but i think it'll continue. i don't want to see a boy hulk, it's just too hokey.

besides, would bruce banner want to pass on his curse to another generation. i think he would rather die than see his own offspring go through the same torment he's endured. so right there i'm turned off to the idea. i'm having problems with this show already. unless the government or some secret organization has created an offspring of him with his own dna and without him knowing. i hope they go that route and not banner and betty having a child and raising it together. that'd be way goofy. for this idea to work, this kid would have to be tormented and angry inside, like x23 feels toward wolverine. there'd have to be tension between father and son, not some happy relationship. well, maybe over time as the series progresses.

the stupidity is just so immense.. you would think that the Marvel Films reps would have VETO POWER over stuff like this.. I presume this is something a WB exec came up with.. but of course, Marvel went along with it, to get a show on the air.. geez..

BTW: "Ms. Lion", from the Spidey/Friends show, was created at the behest of an NBC exec..
http://www.geocities.com/jonfalkner/index.html

 

[Spider-Man]

I think the reason why most of his animated appearances have been mediocre is because he's actually a hard character to get down. People bore of the "Hulk Smash!" version very quickly. Yes, that does provide for some great animated sequences, but it just gets tedious after awhile. And the fact that there have been so many different interpretations of the great characters makes it hard to nail down precisely.

However, the first season of UPN's series is the cloest they ever came to getting the character, as far as I'm concerned. Wasn't perfect, but it was better than alot of what came before.

 

[James Harvey]

Is it me or did the 1960's series come the closest to the comic book. Then again, the animated series did use comic art and storylines directly from the comics. Heh...ah...never mind.

The 1990's series does seem to be the series that came close to the dark nature of the Hulk. I think the reason why all the animated Hulk shows have been so different is because the executives have no idea how to make this show appeal to their key demographic. The first season of the 1990's Hulk series was incredibly dark, and I was surprised to see how it was advertised. UPN had a terrible marketing campaign, that had little kids pretending to "Hulk out," badly acting, and little girls screaming "I love the Hulk." My god -- is was a hundred times worse than it sounds.

And with the upcoming "Teen Hulk" series? That just sounds like another massive mistake for the character.

 

[Jess Matthews]

I think the fact is that the Hulk isn't really a character that translates well to kids television. Then you have to less emphasize the tortured nature of the character with the fact that he's huge, green, and can benchpress a tank.

It's why the 80s series was balanced out with the more silly elements, and probably why, after the first season's balance in the "dark tortured character" direction, they swung it to the opposite extreme. (in the worst possible way, but...)

The best thing to do? Don't even think about approaching Kids' WB or Regular CN. Instead, go higher in your audience and seek out a more "mature" place to air the show. MTV, Spike TV, Adult Swim, all could work. Though I'm thinking more in terms of Sci-Fi Channel. At least for now, it's under the same umbrella as Universal, which produced the movie, and I imagine is developing the animated series. It'd be a good vertical fit and it would work.

 

[James Harvey]

I think the fact is that the Hulk isn't really a character that translates well to kids television. Then you have to less emphasize the tortured nature of the character with the fact that he's huge, green, and can benchpress a tank.

You nailed it dead on, Matt. Despite the simple set up of the character, hit by a gamma bomb, it's a very complicated character that can't be easily translated. Yet, UPN did a real good job on the first season, as they did dive into some of the complexities, while completely avoiding others. For awhile, it did work. Them...there was season two...