"Marvel's Spider-Man" (Animated Series) News & Discussion Thread, Part 3 (Spoilers)

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Here are some new descriptions for the episodes set to premiere in September from the Disney Press website. The synopsis for "Party Animals" remains unchanged but the one for "A Day in the Life" also mentions Black Cat will appear.
"A Day in the Life" sounds like a low-key episode as we see Spidey tangle with Black Cat and juggle his double-life. Hopefully both aspects are fun and well-handled, especially Black Cat ;).

So "Sandman" is not only the debut of Sandman and Sandgirl but the debut of the Black Suit (with the Symbiote debuting in the "Day in the Life"). Kind of interesting that the premise sounds more like Spidey helping the family reunite rather then trying to stop them :ack:.

"Symbiotic Relationship" basically sums up every Black Suit arc ever :p.

So Peter is apparently stuck with his homemade costume in "Stark Expo," which makes me wonder what happened to the classic suit, and it sounds like he still hasn't gotten rid of the Symbiote yet :eek:.

So the "Ultimate Spider-Man" is Miles after all. I guess he gets bit by one of the other experimental Spiders that got loose at OsCorp (so will that be true for all the other Spiders?) o_O.

I wonder if Miles is going to factor into Spidey and Kraven's showdown at all?
 
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So all three Black suit episodes in one day. Well that's convenient
 
They're really rushing through things, aren't they? Peter gets the Black Suit before all other Peters do, Miles gets empowered before the 10th episode, thus turning the title of "Spider-Man" obsolete before we're even through the first half of the season.

It's clear they don't want Peter to be the only Spider-Person in media anymore, so why did they call this show "Spider-Man"? Why did they introduce the Venom symbiote before Peter even gets himself semi-established as a superhero? Even Ultimate Spider-Man didn't get into the Venom storyline this quickly.

This show is starting to reek of the writers or showrunners revolting against the higher-ups. They were told to make a back-to-basics Spider-Man show, and that's what they've marketed this show as, but it's becoming clear this is rapidly becoming anything but. They didn't want to make a back to basics Spider-Man show, they wanted to do something else entirely, so they used the trappings of a rookie Spider-Man and rush through a few of the expected plotlines before they get to what they wanted, which is clearly a super sci-fi take on Spidey surrounded by other Spider-People.

What was the point of cancelling Ultimate Spider-Man then?
 
They're really rushing through things, aren't they? Peter gets the Black Suit before all other Peters do, Miles gets empowered before the 10th episode, thus turning the title of "Spider-Man" obsolete before we're even through the first half of the season
At least it seems to be a 3-episode arc like the Black Suit Saga generally is in animation. I was honestly expecting it to only last for one episode :sweat:.

I know the title implies it but I really can't say I'm expecting them to actually have Miles go by Spider-Man on this show. Not that I prefer Kid-Arachnid either :shrug:.

It's clear they don't want Peter to be the only Spider-Person in media anymore, so why did they call this show "Spider-Man"? Why did they introduce the Venom symbiote before Peter even gets himself semi-established as a superhero? Even Ultimate Spider-Man didn't get into the Venom storyline this quickly
I think compared to the Superhero cartoons of yesteryear there isn't as much focus on playing the "long game" or building up to stuff anymore.

Granted, to some degree we will be getting that with certain characters here (Harry, Otto, probably Norman).

I think it's also telling that we still don't know who Venom is yet so there may be more to this story then this 3-episode Symbiote arc.

This show is starting to reek of the writers or showrunners revolting against the higher-ups. They were told to make a back-to-basics Spider-Man show, and that's what they've marketed this show as, but it's becoming clear this is rapidly becoming anything but. They didn't want to make a back to basics Spider-Man show, they wanted to do something else entirely, so they used the trappings of a rookie Spider-Man and rush through a few of the expected plotlines before they get to what they wanted, which is clearly a super sci-fi take on Spidey surrounded by other Spider-People
Well, I think Marvel wanted a relatively more "back-to-basics" Spider-Man cartoon to tie-in to the movie but they also wanted to promote the other Spider-character despite the lack of connection between them and Peter in the comics.

So as a compromise we have Peter starting out as a solo hero juggling a double-life but we'll also have the other Spiders popping up in relatively major roles as supporting characters and other Superheroes.
What was the point of cancelling Ultimate Spider-Man then?
To have a new cartoon to tie-in to the new Spider-Man movie. That seems to be the bulk of the reasoning behind it.
 
Loving super strong Spiderman in this show. I love it when Marvel remembers that Spiderman isn't a wimp and has lifted helicopters and physically hurt the Hulk before.
 
I think compared to the Superhero cartoons of yesteryear there isn't as much focus on playing the "long game" or building up to stuff anymore.

Granted, to some degree we will be getting that with certain characters here (Harry, Otto, probably Norman).

I think it's also telling that we still don't know who Venom is yet so there may be more to this story then this 3-episode Symbiote arc.

Well, I think Marvel wanted a relatively more "back-to-basics" Spider-Man cartoon to tie-in to the movie but they also wanted to promote the other Spider-character despite the lack of connection between them and Peter in the comics.

So as a compromise we have Peter starting out as a solo hero juggling a double-life but we'll also have the other Spiders popping up in relatively major roles as supporting characters and other Superheroes.

To have a new cartoon to tie-in to the new Spider-Man movie. That seems to be the bulk of the reasoning behind it.

I've noticed this trend and it's frankly disappointing that current gag/comedy cartoons are playing the longer game better (or at least making more of an effort) than modern superhero cartoons. I had no trouble paying attention to longer, ongoing plots when I was a kid, and I don't think modern kids have this issue either. I think Marvel has gotten what it was like to be kids once upon a time and now they're guessing what kids like because they don't understand what it's like to actually be a kid.

The 3-episode arc seems to be starting off as a Black Suit thing before finding its host so there's no way to tell who will be Venom or what form Venom will take. I'd like to think Marvel is done with symbiotes being overpowered sentient beings like they were in USM, but you never know, they might go that route again.

Now, the part I bolded above is where my consternation lies, and let me explain why.

The first three episodes of this show, while being better than USM, are still a disappointment to me, and in your post lies a rationale that I think plays a big role in why this show still doesn't work for me despite ostensible improvements to make it a better show.

They want to do a back to basics show. They also want to promote the Avengers and the other Spider-kids.

You can't do both of these things. You have to choose one or the other. And by trying to merge both, you wind up with the latter scenario, of it being an advertisement for other superheroes and other Spider-characters anyway. All of this extra stuff undermines the premise of it being Peter as a solo, rookie superhero, and ultimately makes it another take on USM just with a facelift.

By featuring the other Spider-kids and Avengers so quickly, they undermine their own premise of this being Peter Parker striking out into the world as a rookie superhero. By giving him other Spider-characters, Peter can't realistically act like a brand-new, rookie hero, or you will have disasters that S&P will have conniption fits over. So Peter will have to be a mentor figure long before he should be.

By having the Avengers cameo so soon, it reduces the emphasis on Peter being the center of his world, and instead makes it clear he's just a cog in a larger machine. Even if the Avenger characters ultimately give him the thumbs-up, it reduces Peter's agency, he has to rely on adult approval for his actions rather than try to figure things out for himself and dealing with his mistakes.

Hell, this whole concept of a genius high school also undermines Peter to a degree. By being surrounded by other geniuses, Peter is no longer special. He will soon be surrounded by three other Spider-kids in quick order. This also no longer makes him special. He's just another Spider-character, the leader of a team, perhaps, but ultimately he is not the lone, solitary Spider-Man. What makes him so unique; his intellect, his power-set, his relationships with ordinary people, this setup undermines all of that because it's all been stripped away from him. He's just another genius, just another Spider-character, and he's surrounded by other supers rather than standing on his own.

This cartoon has reduced Peter into being lesser than the sum of his parts, and I fear this cartoon has taken a giant step towards rendering Peter Parker ultimately expendable.
 
I've noticed this trend and it's frankly disappointing that current gag/comedy cartoons are playing the longer game better (or at least making more of an effort) than modern superhero cartoons. I had no trouble paying attention to longer, ongoing plots when I was a kid, and I don't think modern kids have this issue either. I think Marvel has gotten what it was like to be kids once upon a time and now they're guessing what kids like because they don't understand what it's like to actually be a kid.

The 3-episode arc seems to be starting off as a Black Suit thing before finding its host so there's no way to tell who will be Venom or what form Venom will take. I'd like to think Marvel is done with symbiotes being overpowered sentient beings like they were in USM, but you never know, they might go that route again.

Now, the part I bolded above is where my consternation lies, and let me explain why.

The first three episodes of this show, while being better than USM, are still a disappointment to me, and in your post lies a rationale that I think plays a big role in why this show still doesn't work for me despite ostensible improvements to make it a better show.

They want to do a back to basics show. They also want to promote the Avengers and the other Spider-kids.

You can't do both of these things. You have to choose one or the other. And by trying to merge both, you wind up with the latter scenario, of it being an advertisement for other superheroes and other Spider-characters anyway. All of this extra stuff undermines the premise of it being Peter as a solo, rookie superhero, and ultimately makes it another take on USM just with a facelift.

By featuring the other Spider-kids and Avengers so quickly, they undermine their own premise of this being Peter Parker striking out into the world as a rookie superhero. By giving him other Spider-characters, Peter can't realistically act like a brand-new, rookie hero, or you will have disasters that S&P will have conniption fits over. So Peter will have to be a mentor figure long before he should be.

By having the Avengers cameo so soon, it reduces the emphasis on Peter being the center of his world, and instead makes it clear he's just a cog in a larger machine. Even if the Avenger characters ultimately give him the thumbs-up, it reduces Peter's agency, he has to rely on adult approval for his actions rather than try to figure things out for himself and dealing with his mistakes.

Hell, this whole concept of a genius high school also undermines Peter to a degree. By being surrounded by other geniuses, Peter is no longer special. He will soon be surrounded by three other Spider-kids in quick order. This also no longer makes him special. He's just another Spider-character, the leader of a team, perhaps, but ultimately he is not the lone, solitary Spider-Man. What makes him so unique; his intellect, his power-set, his relationships with ordinary people, this setup undermines all of that because it's all been stripped away from him. He's just another genius, just another Spider-character, and he's surrounded by other supers rather than standing on his own.

This cartoon has reduced Peter into being lesser than the sum of his parts, and I fear this cartoon has taken a giant step towards rendering Peter Parker ultimately expendable.
Reminds me of how DC forgot how to write Superman for years because they started believing the nonsense he was "boring" and they forgot about the fundamental optimism and altruism that make him so appealing. Great post.
 
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As clunky as the name would be maybe they will call Miles Ultimate Spiderman all the time to distinguish the two?
 
As clunky as the name would be maybe they will call Miles Ultimate Spiderman all the time to distinguish the two?
What makes him the Ultimate Spider-Man though (other then as a nod to the comics) :sweat:?
 
What makes him the Ultimate Spider-Man though (other then as a nod to the comics) :sweat:?

To be honest, nothing. If they use the "Ultimate" moniker in the current context while Peter lacks one, it just makes him sound superior to Peter, and that attaches an egoism that runs contrary to Miles' personality.
 
Reminds me of how DC forgot how to write Superman for years because they started believing the nonsense he was "boring" and they forgot about the fundamental optimism and altruism that make him so appealing. Great post.
I've noticed this trend and it's frankly disappointing that current gag/comedy cartoons are playing the longer game better (or at least making more of an effort) than modern superhero cartoons. I had no trouble paying attention to longer, ongoing plots when I was a kid, and I don't think modern kids have this issue either. I think Marvel has gotten what it was like to be kids once upon a time and now they're guessing what kids like because they don't understand what it's like to actually be a kid.

The 3-episode arc seems to be starting off as a Black Suit thing before finding its host so there's no way to tell who will be Venom or what form Venom will take. I'd like to think Marvel is done with symbiotes being overpowered sentient beings like they were in USM, but you never know, they might go that route again.

Now, the part I bolded above is where my consternation lies, and let me explain why.

The first three episodes of this show, while being better than USM, are still a disappointment to me, and in your post lies a rationale that I think plays a big role in why this show still doesn't work for me despite ostensible improvements to make it a better show.

They want to do a back to basics show. They also want to promote the Avengers and the other Spider-kids.

You can't do both of these things. You have to choose one or the other. And by trying to merge both, you wind up with the latter scenario, of it being an advertisement for other superheroes and other Spider-characters anyway. All of this extra stuff undermines the premise of it being Peter as a solo, rookie superhero, and ultimately makes it another take on USM just with a facelift.

By featuring the other Spider-kids and Avengers so quickly, they undermine their own premise of this being Peter Parker striking out into the world as a rookie superhero. By giving him other Spider-characters, Peter can't realistically act like a brand-new, rookie hero, or you will have disasters that S&P will have conniption fits over. So Peter will have to be a mentor figure long before he should be.

By having the Avengers cameo so soon, it reduces the emphasis on Peter being the center of his world, and instead makes it clear he's just a cog in a larger machine. Even if the Avenger characters ultimately give him the thumbs-up, it reduces Peter's agency, he has to rely on adult approval for his actions rather than try to figure things out for himself and dealing with his mistakes.

Hell, this whole concept of a genius high school also undermines Peter to a degree. By being surrounded by other geniuses, Peter is no longer special. He will soon be surrounded by three other Spider-kids in quick order. This also no longer makes him special. He's just another Spider-character, the leader of a team, perhaps, but ultimately he is not the lone, solitary Spider-Man. What makes him so unique; his intellect, his power-set, his relationships with ordinary people, this setup undermines all of that because it's all been stripped away from him. He's just another genius, just another Spider-character, and he's surrounded by other supers rather than standing on his own.

This cartoon has reduced Peter into being lesser than the sum of his parts, and I fear this cartoon has taken a giant step towards rendering Peter Parker ultimately expendable.

WELL SAID!

This is exactly how i feel. I was so stoked and happy to know this is a solo show with a focus on peter. The origin shorts were great, then it all went downhill from there. How can we talk about him mentoring miles so early in the series. Why introduce all these spider characters, making him less unique. and i am so disappointed in making every single peter friend a genius. It marvel animation like we knew since loeb took over: One small step forward two giant steps backward. Oh well, maybe the next decade will be kinder to marvel animation and to us fans.
 
To be honest, nothing. If they use the "Ultimate" moniker in the current context while Peter lacks one, it just makes him sound superior to Peter, and that attaches an egoism that runs contrary to Miles' personality.
I mean, they've already made him into a super-energetic and super-smart genius, so what's one more new trait that Miles has never had in the comics :p?

WELL SAID!

This is exactly how i feel. I was so stoked and happy to know this is a solo show with a focus on peter. The origin shorts were great, then it all went downhill from there. How can we talk about him mentoring miles so early in the series. Why introduce all these spider characters, making him less unique. and i am so disappointed in making every single peter friend a genius. It marvel animation like we knew since loeb took over: One small step forward two giant steps backward. Oh well, maybe the next decade will be kinder to marvel animation and to us fans.
I do think it's really weird that we're going to get a Symbiote storyline and another Spider when Peter will probably have only been Spider-Man for little over a month :sweat:.
 
If every Spider-Man series followed the same backstories and interpretations, that would defeat the whole purpose of making a new show. Ironically, the 'issue' here is that the new Spidey show is too much like Ultimate. :p

It's a different interpretation; regardless of some fabricated belief that Peter Parker and his world have to follow the same formula because anything different or done with a new spin is somehow a disgrace to the character.
 
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If every Spider-Man series followed the same backstories and interpretations, that would defeat the whole purpose of making a new show. Ironically, the 'issue' here is that the new Spidey show is too much like Ultimate. :p

It's a different interpretation; regardless of some fabricated belief that Peter Parker and his world have to follow the same formula because anything different or done with a new spin is somehow a disgrace to the character. That ideology is the reason why I can't take Spider-Man fans seriously.
Obviously every adaptions is allowed to do different things or try and adapt classic stuff in new ways, but at the same time it's understandable that fans may not always care for these changes or feel they're a good fit for the character.
 
Hell, this whole concept of a genius high school also undermines Peter to a degree. By being surrounded by other geniuses, Peter is no longer special.

I generally agreed with your assessment, but this is one area I have no problem with. Same reason I had no problem with it in Homecoming. Peter Parker attending a public high school made sense in the early 60's but with the rise of STEM and magnate schools, it always seemed a little odd to me that he was still attending someplace like Midtown High.

Even if you take the economic aspect out of it (which I was happy to see the show address), you can't tell me someone as brilliant as Peter wouldn't have recruiters knocking at his door with offers. And it'd be one thing if Peter actively tried to downplay how smart he was to avoid sticking out, but in pretty much every continuity he already has a reputation among his classmates for being a brilliant geek even before he gets his powers.

It's one of those things like him working at a newspaper, that made sense when he was created during the silver age, but run the risk of coming off as anachronistic nowadays.
 
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I generally agreed with your assessment, but this is one area I have no problem with. Same reason I had no problem with it in Homecoming. Peter Parker attending a public high school made sense in the early 60's but with the rise of STEM and magnet schools, it always seemed a little odd to me that he was still attending someplace like Midtown High.

Even if you take the economic aspect out of it (which I was happy to see the show address), you can't tell me someone as brilliant as Peter wouldn't have recruiters knocking at his door with offers. And it'd be one thing if Peter actively tried to downplay how smart he was to avoid sticking out, but in pretty much every continuity he already has a reputation among his classmates for being a brilliant geek even before he gets his powers.
If I recall correctly, Midtown in Spectacular was also a magnate school, but just a general one that also included the arts and sports so that Peter could still have his emphasis on science while the rest of the classic supporting cast would still fit in without turning everybody into a super-scientist like at Horizon :sweat:.
 
The genius aspect wouldn't bug me as much if they took it down a peg; closer to Homecoming's obviously.
In the Ultimate comics, this would be the equivalent of
Tony Stark and his middle school or high school Baxter Building buddies.
I recall BH6 being made up of mostly MIT-lite collegians at some extraordinary university.
 
The genius aspect wouldn't bug me as much if they took it down a peg; closer to Homecoming's obviously.
In the Ultimate comics, this would be the equivalent of
Tony Stark and his middle school or high school Baxter Building buddies.
I recall BH6 being made up of mostly MIT-lite collegians at some extraordinary university.
Sort of like how Ultimate Spider-Man's more off the wall humor became toned down as the show went on, the genius aspect in this series (which I think they do well enough) could be toned down so it's more subtle
 
It's a shame that a Spider-Man cartoon that's really emphasizing science can't spotlight the most science-based Marvel heroes, the Fantastic Four :(.
 
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