Rejected DC Comics Designs and Show Pitches

[Yojimbo]

Andy Merrill and the late Dwayne McDuffie pitched an Inferior Five television series.

 

[Frontier]

Andy Merrill and the late Dwayne McDuffie pitched an Inferior Five television series.

This would've been hilarious, and with McDuffie working on it would've been well worth a watch .

 

[iammattie]

Andy Merrill and the late Dwayne McDuffie pitched an Inferior Five television series.

He mentioned this on his forums years back, but of course those have gone down in the time since

lol "a list of every animated thing I've pitched that didn't go" would be cool if you could let us in on it. if you can't no big.
Not that big a list if you eliminate the originals (which I am, as I'm still repitching most of them): A "Batman: Year One" pitch, designs by Denys Cowan, bible by me that came VERY close to happening a couple years ago. An Inferior Five pitch by me and Andy "Brak" Merrill that didn't go far, but DAMN is he funny, I hope to work with him again someday. I've talked about my Phunky Phantom pitch where Bootsy Collins was killed in an electric bass accident in 1976 and is revived in the present, unaware that he's dead. I've done development work on Thundercats, Ben Ten and Kamandi, but in each case the folks who hired me ultimately went in a different direction. I'm probably forgetting some stuff.
11/1/05

 

[Yojimbo]

He mentioned this on his forums years back, but of course those have gone down in the time since

11/1/05, I take it this was from his delphi forums thread?

Batman: Year One pitch, eh? Sounds like something to ask Denys Cowan about. I'm curious if this was a pitch done around the time WBA was making the next Batman show which ultimately became Beware The Batman.

Kamandi, now that's interesting. I know there have been several over the decades. Timm pitched one in 1998. Evan Dorkin and Sarah Dyer worked on one in 2011.

These must have been pitches he did after he was finished with work on the last season of JLU.

 

[iammattie]

11/1/05, I take it this was from his delphi forums thread?

Yupp, that's the one! James Streaker was trying to catalog a bunch of his "Ask the Maestro" thread a couple years back before it shut down. Unfortunately only got a handful of pages before the plug was pulled on the site. Most of it just being dcau minutia and the like.

 

[Yojimbo]

Yupp, that's the one! James Streaker was trying to catalog a bunch of his "Ask the Maestro" thread a couple years back before it shut down. Unfortunately only got a handful of pages before the plug was pulled on the site. Most of it just being dcau minutia and the like.

I don't know if it's good or bad I could immediately tell which of the 3 forums he had that this was from just by the date.

 

[the greenman]

I read years ago on Wiki that Kirby himself tried to get a Kamandi animated series.

Sent from my LM-Q730 using Tapatalk

 

[Frontier]

I read years ago on Wiki that Kirby himself tried to get a Kamandi animated series.

Sent from my LM-Q730 using Tapatalk

I feel like I saw concept art for that too...

 

[RoyalRubble]

I might be confusing the projects but I thought Kirby's Kamandi pitch turned into Thundarr the Barbarian back in the mid '80s. Ot the show ended up being kind of similar and Kirby worked on it, a least.

I can't say I care much for the Inferior Five but I trust McDuffie would have made this entertaining.

A Batman: Year One inspired show might have been nice, too. Though I would still like to see a big Bat-Family show instead one about Batman's early days.

 

[Yojimbo]

I might be confusing the projects but I thought Kirby's Kamandi pitch turned into Thundarr the Barbarian back in the mid '80s. Ot the show ended up being kind of similar and Kirby worked on it, a least.

Pretty sure Joe Ruby and Steve Gerber came up with Thundarr and the latter brought in Kirby to do art.

A Batman: Year One inspired show might have been nice, too. Though I would still like to see a big Bat-Family show instead one about Batman's early days.

True, but as we've seen with the likes of what led to Batman Beyond or The Batman and Beware The Batman, the powers that be have been obsessed with a young Batman for a long time.

 

[Frontier]

True, but as we've seen with the likes of what led to Batman Beyond or The Batman and Beware The Batman, the powers that be have been obsessed with a young Batman for a long time.

From the sounds of it that Batman/Superman pitch had him as an early 20's Batman as well.

I think only that No Man's Land pitch seemed to emphasize an experienced Batman with an established and developed Batfamily.

 

[M.O.D.O.K.]

I think only that No Man's Land pitch seemed to emphasize an experienced Batman with an established and developed Batfamily.

Speaking of that, James Tucker talked a little bit about that. Apparently, Cartoon Network liked the second pitch he did with Mitch Watson (the Batman/Superman World's Finest one), but it didn't get cleared because the "movie guys" didn't think Batman and Superman were in the same universe.

It's some baffling logic, but that's why.

 

[Frontier]

Speaking of that, James Tucker talked a little bit about that. Apparently, Cartoon Network liked the second pitch he did with Mitch Watson (the Batman/Superman World's Finest one), but it didn't get cleared because the "movie guys" didn't think Batman and Superman were in the same universe.

It's some baffling logic, but that's why.

I mean, it makes as much sense as limiting what characters your TV shows or cartoons could use because said characters are in a movie or another show (the Bat-Embargo, the Aqua-Embargo, etc.) .

Also, Yojimbo - That is the perfect reaction gif .

 

[RoyalRubble]

Maybe they would have had better luck if they brought up the concept of the multi-verse.

 

[Otaku-sempai]

I don't remember much, if anything, being posted here about the unproduced follow-up to Batman & Mr. Freeze: Sub-Zero that was to be called Batman: Arkham. There's an article about the project at CBR: An Unmade Batman: The Animated Series Movie Almost Gave Bruce Wayne a New Love Interest.

The World's Finest posted concept art for the film.

 

[Yojimbo]

I don't remember much, if anything, being posted here about the unproduced follow-up to Batman & Mr. Freeze: Sub-Zero that was to be called Batman: Arkham. There's an article about the project at CBR: An Unmade Batman: The Animated Series Movie Almost Gave Bruce Wayne a New Love Interest.

The World's Finest posted concept art for the film.

3/26: Yeah, that's a very brief summary of it. There's a fair amount about how it evolved over time.

Short story: First, Randy Rogel and Boyd Kirkland were doing a Batman vs. Bane DTV, then the powers that be wanted Mr. Freeze because of the live action movie so they started over and made Sub-Zero, then they worked on a follow up Arkham but it was shelved but Harmon ended up on Batman Beyond.

What I've gathered:

• Batman vs. Bane Direct to Video Movie
• Source: Batman Animated
• Summary: Scrapped idea for Sub-Zero
• Link: Batman Animated Podcast #24, 1:30:57-1:31:58
• Who: Randy Rogel
• Released: January 18, 2016
• Quote: He had an idea of using Bane. And so I sat with him. I go, "Bane would be be good. But what we should do is make him the Terminator." So in other words, he is such a formidable opponent that Batman--you can't kill him and he's coming for you. And so that's really scary. And so every time Batman engages him, he gets hurt more and more. So by the fin--the end of it, Batman's in a really bad way and Bane can't be hurt so it was really exciting. At the same time, I introduced a sub-plot with Robin and Batgirl who were dating in their alter-egos but did not know they were each other, you know. So when they would meet as Robin and Batgirl, he didn't like her. He thought she was an amateur. So it had some humor to it. So we wrote this really great little script. And--and it might have, yeah, it was a script because I had a really detailed outline form and we did it to script.
• Source: Back Issue! #99 (September 2017), page 20-21
• Who: Randy Rogel
• Quote: So we wrote this terrific script. I mean, I really loved this story. And there was this lovely B-plot going on between Dick Grayson and Barbara. Bruce asks Dick, "Does she know?" You're going to tell her the truth about yourself. It wouldn't be fair to her. She has to know you're going out and fighting crime at night and you might get yourself killed." So that was all building underneath. And somewhere in the middle of all that we got called over to Warner Home Video. I remember this meeting very well. They said, "Hey, the studio just signed Arnold Schwarzenegger to do the Batman movie, and he's going to play Mr. Freeze, so that's who we want the villain to be." I said, "We already wrote it with Bane." One of the other guys in the room said, "Well, can't you just use your word processor, and where it says 'Bane' just switch it with 'Mr. Freeze'?" I looked at him and said, "It doesn't work that way. He's a completely different villain." I shook my head, "Never mind, we'll just write a new script."
• Link: Watchtower Database "The SUBZERO Sequel + Other Batman & Animaniacs Secrets with Randy Rogel! (Interview)"
• Posted: November 15, 2020
• Who: Randy Rogel
• Summary: At the 10:42-11:04 mark, Randy Rogel reveals he envisioned Bane as the Terminator in that Batman couldn't make a dent in him. As they squared off in the script, Batman gets more wounded and injured. The B-plot was Bruce Wayne falling in love with a woman but it wouldn't work out if he didn't tell her his secret.
• Quote: I said, 'You know what? He makes me think of the Terminator.' So why don't we make Bane basically the Terminator? And you can't kill this guy. Throughout the story, he keeps engaging Bane and every time he gets more and more wounded, more and more injured. And at the same time, I had this kind of alternate story going with Bruce is in love with a woman and it's not going to work out if he can't tell her he's Batman and so it was just a terrific story and it worked great.
  
  Batman: Arkham Direct to Video Movie
• When: Late 90s
• Link: World's Finest
• Summary: Originally scheduled to be a follow-up to the Batman & Mr. Freeze: Sub-Zero animated movie, Batman: Arkham was shelved to make way for the acclaimed Batman Beyond: Return of the Joker direct-to-video title. The plot for this animated feature involved Batman and Robin facing off against a collection of Arkham escapees, in addition to Bruce Wayne finding himself falling in love with a new love interest. Production on this ultimate scrapped feature was so far along that extensive casting was already completed. While all of the Batman: The Animated Series voice cast would have returned, Angie Harmon was already hired to voice Bruce's love interest before the movie was ultimate cancelled. Designer Steven E. Gordon did character design for the feature, with Boyd Kirkland attached to write and direct.
• Link: Batman: The Animated Newsletter #25
• Posted: Week of April 26 to May 1/2, 1999
• Who: Boyd Kirkland
• Quote: The basic storyline of our recently canned (Sealed, trash, thrown away, rubbished, demolished) animated Batman movie involved the Joker and Bane (Is this a coincidence or am I dreaming?), both prisioners in Arkham (For the 6 billionth time), who team up (With each-other or with Bruce Timm) to escape and seek revenge on Batman (Who else?). Bruce Wayne is involved in a heavy romance (With a cut girl?) before this happens (Then his new girlfriend abandons him when Bane and the Joker crash one of their dates), and is seriously considering (A face-lift) retiring the cape and cowl (And the suit and belt) to get married (Yeah, right, it’s probably another one of Poison Ivy's creations) when he's attacked (During a date and his girlfriend leaves him). Robin is seriously injured (Did it damage his bug eyes?!?!?), but plays an important role in helping Batman before the story is over (Meat Grinder, Potato Pealer, Onion slicer). THe story was full of non-stop action (Oh, make us feel WORSE why don't you!) and eye-popping visuals (AH! STOP STOP! Your beginning to sound like an advertisement!), as well as had a lot of heart and romance (Oh, MAN!). I had one of the best studios in Japan lined up to animate it, with a bigger budget than I had for "Sub-Zero". It would have been great (Sigh). Needless to say, I'm extremely disappointed (Of Course!) that it won't be made (OF COURSE!). Oh, Well - time to move on.
• Link: Anime Superhero
• Posted: February 12, 2005
• Who: Bruce Timm
• Quote: actually, i seem to remember the "virtual joker" being in the "BATMAN : ASYLUM" script that boyd kirkland and randy rogel wrote.....but i could be wrong...
• Link: Batman Animated Podcast #24, 1:44:28-1:46:27
• Who: Randy Rogel
• Released: January 18, 2016
• Quote: At this point in the middle of it, was it -- I think -- did I go back to the Bane story? Can't remember because I remember there's this funny scene where Batgirl and Robin are running into each other and getting in each other's way. In fact, I saw--remember The Incredibles? He--she's going "I had him!" "No, I had him." Remember that? They're arguing. And at one point, he's talking--things are getting really serious between Barbara and Dick. And so Bruce is the one who says, "Are you going to tell her that you're Robin? Don't you think she has the right to know that? Because you know, she may not want anything to do--she'll think you're going to get yourself killed." He really puts the heat on it. And so he goes, "Maybe you're right." So at one point, when she comes to visit, he says, "I have something to show you." Because in an earlier scene, I'd had where he called--as Robin--"You're a rank amateur." He said something like that to her. So he takes Barbara and he takes her down to the Batcave. And she's standing there stunned. And he's kinda there with a smirk on his face. Basically the subtext is, "Yeah, I'm Robin. I'm cool." And she turns around and slugs him right in the mouth. He goes down. She goes, "What do you mean I'm a rank amateur?" And he goes, "Oh...wait a minute! You're--you're--" That's when they find out who each other is. And right in the crux of that, boom, they--Bane is on the attack and they have to forget about that and get to the business, and so they're working together only they now know who each other is. And there was this whole issue of can we make a family in this? One of us can get killed. It was a terrific script but we ended up never being able to do it.

3/28: At the Justice Society Wonder Con panel, at 3:44, Butch Lukic revealed he and Jim Krieg pitched a Wonder Woman animated series to DC Universe and it appeared to be set during World War II all before the 1st Wonder Woman live action movie came out. Fast forward, when Lukic and co. had to pitch story ideas for the DCU line of DTVs, of the 7 or 8, one of this WW pitch and more or less seemed to have evolved into the Justice Society movie by then.

 

[Frontier]

3/26: Yeah, that's a very brief summary of it. There's a fair amount about how it evolved over time.

Short story: First, Randy Rogel and Boyd Kirkland were doing a Batman vs. Bane DTV, then the powers that be wanted Mr. Freeze because of the live action movie so they started over and made Sub-Zero, then they worked on a follow up Arkham but it was shelved but Harmon ended up on Batman Beyond.

What I've gathered:

• Batman vs. Bane Direct to Video Movie
• Source: Batman Animated
• Summary: Scrapped idea for Sub-Zero
• Link: Batman Animated Podcast #24, 1:30:57-1:31:58
• Who: Randy Rogel
• Released: January 18, 2016
• Quote: He had an idea of using Bane. And so I sat with him. I go, "Bane would be be good. But what we should do is make him the Terminator." So in other words, he is such a formidable opponent that Batman--you can't kill him and he's coming for you. And so that's really scary. And so every time Batman engages him, he gets hurt more and more. So by the fin--the end of it, Batman's in a really bad way and Bane can't be hurt so it was really exciting. At the same time, I introduced a sub-plot with Robin and Batgirl who were dating in their alter-egos but did not know they were each other, you know. So when they would meet as Robin and Batgirl, he didn't like her. He thought she was an amateur. So it had some humor to it. So we wrote this really great little script. And--and it might have, yeah, it was a script because I had a really detailed outline form and we did it to script.
• Source: Back Issue! #99 (September 2017), page 20-21
• Who: Randy Rogel
• Quote: So we wrote this terrific script. I mean, I really loved this story. And there was this lovely B-plot going on between Dick Grayson and Barbara. Bruce asks Dick, "Does she know?" You're going to tell her the truth about yourself. It wouldn't be fair to her. She has to know you're going out and fighting crime at night and you might get yourself killed." So that was all building underneath. And somewhere in the middle of all that we got called over to Warner Home Video. I remember this meeting very well. They said, "Hey, the studio just signed Arnold Schwarzenegger to do the Batman movie, and he's going to play Mr. Freeze, so that's who we want the villain to be." I said, "We already wrote it with Bane." One of the other guys in the room said, "Well, can't you just use your word processor, and where it says 'Bane' just switch it with 'Mr. Freeze'?" I looked at him and said, "It doesn't work that way. He's a completely different villain." I shook my head, "Never mind, we'll just write a new script."
• Link: Watchtower Database "The SUBZERO Sequel + Other Batman & Animaniacs Secrets with Randy Rogel! (Interview)"
• Posted: November 15, 2020
• Who: Randy Rogel
• Summary: At the 10:42-11:04 mark, Randy Rogel reveals he envisioned Bane as the Terminator in that Batman couldn't make a dent in him. As they squared off in the script, Batman gets more wounded and injured. The B-plot was Bruce Wayne falling in love with a woman but it wouldn't work out if he didn't tell her his secret.
• Quote: I said, 'You know what? He makes me think of the Terminator.' So why don't we make Bane basically the Terminator? And you can't kill this guy. Throughout the story, he keeps engaging Bane and every time he gets more and more wounded, more and more injured. And at the same time, I had this kind of alternate story going with Bruce is in love with a woman and it's not going to work out if he can't tell her he's Batman and so it was just a terrific story and it worked great.
  
  Batman: Arkham Direct to Video Movie
• When: Late 90s
• Link: World's Finest
• Summary: Originally scheduled to be a follow-up to the Batman & Mr. Freeze: Sub-Zero animated movie, Batman: Arkham was shelved to make way for the acclaimed Batman Beyond: Return of the Joker direct-to-video title. The plot for this animated feature involved Batman and Robin facing off against a collection of Arkham escapees, in addition to Bruce Wayne finding himself falling in love with a new love interest. Production on this ultimate scrapped feature was so far along that extensive casting was already completed. While all of the Batman: The Animated Series voice cast would have returned, Angie Harmon was already hired to voice Bruce's love interest before the movie was ultimate cancelled. Designer Steven E. Gordon did character design for the feature, with Boyd Kirkland attached to write and direct.
• Link: Batman: The Animated Newsletter #25
• Posted: Week of April 26 to May 1/2, 1999
• Who: Boyd Kirkland
• Quote: The basic storyline of our recently canned (Sealed, trash, thrown away, rubbished, demolished) animated Batman movie involved the Joker and Bane (Is this a coincidence or am I dreaming?), both prisioners in Arkham (For the 6 billionth time), who team up (With each-other or with Bruce Timm) to escape and seek revenge on Batman (Who else?). Bruce Wayne is involved in a heavy romance (With a cut girl?) before this happens (Then his new girlfriend abandons him when Bane and the Joker crash one of their dates), and is seriously considering (A face-lift) retiring the cape and cowl (And the suit and belt) to get married (Yeah, right, it’s probably another one of Poison Ivy's creations) when he's attacked (During a date and his girlfriend leaves him). Robin is seriously injured (Did it damage his bug eyes?!?!?), but plays an important role in helping Batman before the story is over (Meat Grinder, Potato Pealer, Onion slicer). THe story was full of non-stop action (Oh, make us feel WORSE why don't you!) and eye-popping visuals (AH! STOP STOP! Your beginning to sound like an advertisement!), as well as had a lot of heart and romance (Oh, MAN!). I had one of the best studios in Japan lined up to animate it, with a bigger budget than I had for "Sub-Zero". It would have been great (Sigh). Needless to say, I'm extremely disappointed (Of Course!) that it won't be made (OF COURSE!). Oh, Well - time to move on.
• Link: Anime Superhero
• Posted: February 12, 2005
• Who: Bruce Timm
• Quote: actually, i seem to remember the "virtual joker" being in the "BATMAN : ASYLUM" script that boyd kirkland and randy rogel wrote.....but i could be wrong...
• Link: Batman Animated Podcast #24, 1:44:28-1:46:27
• Who: Randy Rogel
• Released: January 18, 2016
• Quote: At this point in the middle of it, was it -- I think -- did I go back to the Bane story? Can't remember because I remember there's this funny scene where Batgirl and Robin are running into each other and getting in each other's way. In fact, I saw--remember The Incredibles? He--she's going "I had him!" "No, I had him." Remember that? They're arguing. And at one point, he's talking--things are getting really serious between Barbara and Dick. And so Bruce is the one who says, "Are you going to tell her that you're Robin? Don't you think she has the right to know that? Because you know, she may not want anything to do--she'll think you're going to get yourself killed." He really puts the heat on it. And so he goes, "Maybe you're right." So at one point, when she comes to visit, he says, "I have something to show you." Because in an earlier scene, I'd had where he called--as Robin--"You're a rank amateur." He said something like that to her. So he takes Barbara and he takes her down to the Batcave. And she's standing there stunned. And he's kinda there with a smirk on his face. Basically the subtext is, "Yeah, I'm Robin. I'm cool." And she turns around and slugs him right in the mouth. He goes down. She goes, "What do you mean I'm a rank amateur?" And he goes, "Oh...wait a minute! You're--you're--" That's when they find out who each other is. And right in the crux of that, boom, they--Bane is on the attack and they have to forget about that and get to the business, and so they're working together only they now know who each other is. And there was this whole issue of can we make a family in this? One of us can get killed. It was a terrific script but we ended up never being able to do it.

Sounds like we were this close to a relative animated adaption of Knightfall before we ended up with Sub-Zero...not that I mind, but it felt like their one chance to really do Bane justice .

Y'know, I honestly prefer that take on Dick and Babs learning each other's identities than what actually happened...although I guess it also wasn't as depressing .

3/28: At the Justice Society Wonder Con panel, at 3:44, Butch Lukic revealed he and Jim Krieg pitched a Wonder Woman animated series to DC Universe and it appeared to be set during World War II all before the 1st Wonder Woman live action movie came out. Fast forward, when Lukic and co. had to pitch story ideas for the DCU line of DTVs, of the 7 or 8, one of this WW pitch and more or less seemed to have evolved into the Justice Society movie by then.

Reminds me of that Golden Age concept art James Tucker did .

I wonder if all 7 or 8 ended up becoming movies ?

 

[RoyalRubble]

So Wonder Woman once again misses out on getting her own animated series. Not too surprising I guess but at least we're still getting a movie out of this idea, which can't be said about other such rejected pitches over the years.

 

[SweetShop209]

Maybe this Wonder Woman pitch series wasn't accepted because the 2015 DC Superhero Girls was still going on, and they probably didn't want to confuse audiences (think with how, while multiple DC shows can run at once, you usually don't get something like 2 Batman series or two Justice League series running at once).

 

[Frontier]

Wonder Woman getting her own cartoon just feels like an everlasting quest at this point .