Toonami Ratings

[RabidInuyashaFan]

You're wrong about adhd. It's not a typical sitcom block. It's definitely going to appeal to animated action fans & you need only visit the site & watch some shows to understand that. The Nielsen viewers are more typical of general viewers than the niche you want them to be. About the only thing you can say for certain about them is that they like animated action. As to whether they have a prefence to drama/comedy/sitcom remains to be seen.

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Perhaps you've lost sight of what's being discussed so I'll recap it. Sat's LLN ratings are pathetic in comparison to Fri's LLN & when looking at other networks over the 2 nights, it's not the night but rather the lineup that is mostly to blame. It's overshadowed by strength in PT & LN but LN will be threatened by adhd. I believe [as] 11p could fall as much as 20% against Axe Cop & HS USA. When that happens LLN's weakness will become more apparent. Jason's bosses will naturally ask these ?s: how can we strengthen LN & feed off adhd in LLN? The best way to strengthen LN is to expand Toonami on the believe the earlier hr will pull in more viewers that don't stay up past 12a. The best way to strengthen LLN is offer shows that will appeal to the adhd viewers. The bosses will naturally look to FG & DeMarco will have to sell them on alternative shows. That will work as long as the alternative shows succeed. Continued weakness will naturally lead to FG & then it's a question of how best to make that work.

 

[Jeff Harris]

Ratings, in the long run, don't matter.

They're just like points on Whose Line Is It Anyway?.

Tripper Harrison, played by the awesome Bill Murray in Meatballs, said it just doesn't matter if we win or if we lose, and when it comes to ratings quarterbacking, particularly those over-analyzing Toonami (emphasis on the anal), this belief becomes a truism.

One cannot simply compare ratings of every day of the week on a cable block any more than one could walk into Moldor. It's not that simple, especially when you consider the fact that Saturday night is THE LEAST WATCHED NIGHT OF TELEVISION. Broadcast networks have given up on it. Very few "basic" cable channels actually present original productions, and those that do are networks aimed towards younger viewers who tend to stay home rather than go out on a Saturday night. BBC America's Supernatural Saturdays block are an exception mostly because they're on "digital" tiers and tend to air certain shows the same day it airs in the UK.

People, particularly young adults who aren't going to church the next day, tend to go out on Saturdays and party it up. They're more likely to go out on Saturdays than Fridays and Sundays. On Fridays, they may be too knackered from work to do anything but get a few drinks after work while on Sundays, they know the long, hard work week is about to begin.

You know who's more likely to do this? Nielsen households. The average Nielsen household is comprised of upper-middle class Americans between the ages of 25-34 with two kids between the ages of 6-12. There are 114.2 million households with television or some kind of video service in the US, and yet 25 - 30,000 households, less than .02% of the total TV landscape, are the ones determining the fate of every show you watch and don't watch. Power concentrated to an insultingly low number.

Don't take them so seriously. In fact, stop worrying about them.

If you're not in one of those Nielsen households, stop worrying about ratings! You're literally not counted at all in the Nielsens. Really, you're not part of that number

If you're not an employee working at a network that analyze these ratings, stop worrying about ratings!

If you're not an advertiser selling a product ad to a network that watches ratings, stop worrying about ratings!

They don't matter to you otherwise. Quit being so ratings-obsessed.

The ratings are fine. I feel like this. If you can get over 200,000 looking at a TV show on a Sunday morning at 3 AM, I think you're in no position to complain. The powers-that-be aren't all that worried about ratings, and neither should you, especially people foolishly believing that inserting an already over-saturated series that could easily go to the competition in a couple of years. The idea of putting that show in the middle of an action block is self-destructive, moronic, inane, nonsensical, farfetched, and stupid as hell.

Oh, and don't worry about stuff that's not even airing at the same time as Toonami on broadcast TV. Saturday Night Live wins every time. They've been on since 1975, and they've ruled Saturday late nights just as long.

 

[Mohji]

This Family Guy argument is going nowhere, I suggest we drop it and move on. This is the same guy who insisted One Piece would be a better fit for Nicktoons than Toonami because of cross-promotion with Spongebob, it's like taking to a brick wall.

If Adult Swim was that desperate for ratings, Saturday night would be a Family Guy marathon by now.

 

[SpecialColorfull]

But Nicktoons doesn even air Spongebob all that much...LOL.

 

[RabidInuyashaFan]

Noinsense. Ratings are all that matter. They determine the value of slots for sponsors & they are the main factor in whether shows are moved, removed, replaced, cancelled, & renewed. Neither [as] nor Toonami are exceptions & both have demonstrated such changes in the past yr. While it's true that a very small % of HH's are represented on a nightly basis it's wrong to say the rest of the homes don't matter at all. Nielsen ended pretty much all criticisms when they agreed to collect set top data from providers on a nightly basis as a form of quality assurance for their in-house representation. They use that to both re-configure their local representation & adjust ratings. The most notable changes in recent yrs were the coverage of over 2000 campuses which resulted in a big rise in [as] ratings & the decline in Nick ratings. Over time, Nielsen reconfigured their coverage & Nick ratings started to rise again. It's that QA process that has made it very difficult for any of their competitors to gain any traction locally & so Nielsen is a bigger monopoly now. As I've said many times before, it's a confidence game & since ratings = revenue for networks no one is willing to break the mold.

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OP failed on CN & the WB/CW in yrs past because neither it's chars nor storyline appealed enough to kids. That's why Nick never pulled the trigger to bring it to their networks. There was enough history there to rule it out. It's coming to [as] because Toei finally acknowledged this & decided targeting OP towards 12-24 is better than nothing. There's little evidence in manga & anime sales over the yrs that suggest it's a sure thing with that demog either. So odds are the deal is for 1 season only & the price will be renegotiated at renewal based on the ratings. Funimation decided to start with S4 because in the event it's not renewed they at least gain the promotional value of it on Toonami for their S5 release.

 

[Ishtar]

All things considered, airing Family Guy on Toonami just to sell out for ratings is a TERRIBLE idea, and fortunately DeMarco will NEVER resort to such a ludicrous idea. You can complain about it all you want, but that won't change it from not happening. There's also the Toonami brand and image to uphold, not to mention their relationship with their fans. You are the ONLY one demanding that they air Family Guy, and you are only doing so out of paranoia of how negatively FOX's ADHD block could effect Toonami. NO OTHER Toonami fan WANTS it on the block. Is there some other hidden motive for such a demand? Oh wait, its probably because you want InuYasha to get better ratings at 5am, since then there would be a bigger likely hood of them picking up your precious Final Act. It all goes back to that one show with you, doesn't it? Because that's the biggest show Toonami is aiming to air someday, according to you!

PS: Toonami has said before that they read this forum, so I'm sure they're just laughing their heads off at this entire argument. Quit acting like you know the television business more than these people do, who have worked in it for quite some time. Hell, DeMarco even tweeted before that he wished ratings weren't public, because people like you "obsess over them like they are box office numbers, when there is much more to the story." After seeing this ridiculous debate, I can completely see where he is coming from. There are many things neither of us completely understand about this subject, even though you insist you do because as DeMarco would say you "read about it on the internet." That said, I am done with discussing this. Good day, sir.

 

[HG Revolution]

OP failed on CN & the WB/CW in yrs past because neither it's chars nor storyline appealed enough to kids. That's why Nick never pulled the trigger to bring it to their networks. There was enough history there to rule it out.

Which is exactly what everyone here did except for you.

 

[voicerocker]

I've read over the last few pages and can't believe someone is trying to justify airing Family Guy on Toonami. Here's the answer to that: no. Family Guy has NO place on Toonami at all. Toonami is an ACTION CARTOON block. Proof: The State Of Toonami Speech - YouTube Notice how TOM says he's noticed others trying to "break into the action cartoon biz". Toonami is for action shows. Anything non-action that aired on Toonami before (such as Hamtaro) was a decision made by the higher-ups at CN and forced Toonami to air it during their block. The Toonami crew admitted they had no choice in Hamtaro and during the end of the TOM 4 era, they had little say in what shows they aired.

Tenchi Muyo! GXP was a flop. It has next to no action and went from the 2nd show of the night at 12:30am to being bumped all the way back to 3:00am, behind even the rerunning Eureka 7. And about GXP beating Eureka, that doesn't happen every week. In fact, Eureka 7 beat GXP half the time. And too be honest, it doesn't really matter because the drops from Eureka/GXP aren't even worth mentioning because they're so small. GXP is only on Toonami because of the "Tenchi Muyo!" name. The staff even said once that they weren't sure if they would have picked up GXP if Toonami were still Adult Swim Action.

Truthfully, [adult swim] should be very pleased with Toonami right now. Bleach, Naruto and Soul Eater were all #1 in [as]'s key demo last week, the 18-34 demo. Why would they be worried if their shows are #1? They're not, and the Toonami guys have said their bosses are quite pleased with how Toonami is doing. Add to that the return of One Piece uncut and Toonami should do even better.

Family Guy will only air on Saturdays if [adult swim] gets rid of Toonami and all of their anime. Anime has been getting the lowest ratings for years on [adult swim], to the point that Adult Swim Action was nearly dead. They keep it around on Saturdays because they like it. Saturday is THE worst night to air something, ESPECIALLY after midnight. Toonami actually is airing in the worst timeslot possible, so they have no reason to expect it to compete with Friday night ratings. The fact that anime is still on [adult swim] AND the fact that they decided to invest in fully reviving Toonami as a weekly block suggests ratings aren't as important to [as] on Saturday as the rest of the week. If [adult swim] truly wanted to get the best ratings on Saturday, Family Guy would already be airing.

So yes, if ratings were THAT important to [adult swim], Toonami wouldn't even be on the air today and [adult swim] would have gotten rid of their anime years ago. Family Guy will NOT air on Toonami, and the very idea of Family Guy on Toonami makes no sense at all.

 

[RabidInuyashaFan]

I'm a Toonami fan & I would welcome select ep of FG & SC from 2:30-3:30. That's how easy it is to refute childish posts that include exagerated claims as "no fan wants it." Next I'll probably read something stupid like "you're not a Toonami fan because you want it." I can't believe someone is so ???? enough to compare Hamtaro to FamGuy. Why even bother to post such drivel in a Toonami ratings thread? If you don't think ratings are all that important then why bother posting here? I guess you're just a moth drawn to the flame. The ratings prove that TC, ST, & E7 are nothing but wastes of space in the lineup now so I'm looking forward to their exits. I'd rather see War of Geminar follow IGPX than the continuation of these tiresome relics.

---

I didn't rule out OP on a Nick network because obviously it comes down to price. If the price is right they would gladly take on OP. Nick decided original YGO & Zexal were better buys instead.

 

[voicerocker]

I'm a Toonami fan & I would welcome select ep of FG & SC from 2:30-3:30. That's how easy it is to refute childish posts that include exagerated claims as "no fan wants it." Next I'll probably read something stupid like "you're not a Toonami fan because you want it." I can't believe someone is so ???? enough to compare Hamtaro to FamGuy. Why even bother to post such drivel in a Toonami ratings thread? If you don't think ratings are all that important then why bother posting here? I guess you're just a moth drawn to the flame. The ratings prove that TC, ST, & E7 are nothing but wastes of space in the lineup now so I'm looking forward to their exits. I'd rather see War of Geminar follow IGPX than the continuation of these tiresome relics.

---

I didn't rule out OP on a Nick network because obviously it comes down to price. If the price is right they would gladly take on OP. Nick decided original YGO & Zexal were better buys instead.

You're missing the key point: Toonami is an ACTION CARTOON BLOCK. A purely comedic show like Family Guy has no place on Toonami. Guess what: SpongeBob has action in some of its episodes. Should Toonami go after SpongeBob then? NO. Family Guy does NOT fit the theme of Toonami. That alone is why it should never air on Toonami, regardless of how ratings are doing. And again, if [adult swim] felt they HAD to air Family Guy during Toonami hours, they'd cancel Toonami right now.

You're also very wrong in saying ThunderCats, Sym-Bionic Titan and Eureka 7 are "wastes of space". Ratings have been noticeably better since GXP was pushed to 3:00am. ThunderCats has become the 1st show on Toonami to hold 1 million viewers at 1:00am AND at 1:30am, with Sym-Bionic Titan usually not all that far behind. That is NOT a waste of space. Eureka 7 seems to be doing fine where it's at, not great, but that's probably why it hasn't aired earlier in the night.

 

[Snowballx]

Ratings, in the long run, don't matter.

They're just like points on Whose Line Is It Anyway?.

Tripper Harrison, played by the awesome Bill Murray in Meatballs, said it just doesn't matter if we win or if we lose, and when it comes to ratings quarterbacking, particularly those over-analyzing Toonami (emphasis on the anal), this belief becomes a truism.

One cannot simply compare ratings of every day of the week on a cable block any more than one could walk into Moldor. It's not that simple, especially when you consider the fact that Saturday night is THE LEAST WATCHED NIGHT OF TELEVISION. Broadcast networks have given up on it. Very few "basic" cable channels actually present original productions, and those that do are networks aimed towards younger viewers who tend to stay home rather than go out on a Saturday night. BBC America's Supernatural Saturdays block are an exception mostly because they're on "digital" tiers and tend to air certain shows the same day it airs in the UK.

People, particularly young adults who aren't going to church the next day, tend to go out on Saturdays and party it up. They're more likely to go out on Saturdays than Fridays and Sundays. On Fridays, they may be too knackered from work to do anything but get a few drinks after work while on Sundays, they know the long, hard work week is about to begin.

You know who's more likely to do this? Nielsen households. The average Nielsen household is comprised of upper-middle class Americans between the ages of 25-34 with two kids between the ages of 6-12. There are 114.2 million households with television or some kind of video service in the US, and yet 25 - 30,000 households, less than .02% of the total TV landscape, are the ones determining the fate of every show you watch and don't watch. Power concentrated to an insultingly low number.

Don't take them so seriously. In fact, stop worrying about them.

If you're not in one of those Nielsen households, stop worrying about ratings! You're literally not counted at all in the Nielsens. Really, you're not part of that number

If you're not an employee working at a network that analyze these ratings, stop worrying about ratings!

If you're not an advertiser selling a product ad to a network that watches ratings, stop worrying about ratings!

They don't matter to you otherwise. Quit being so ratings-obsessed.

The ratings are fine. I feel like this. If you can get over 200,000 looking at a TV show on a Sunday morning at 3 AM, I think you're in no position to complain. The powers-that-be aren't all that worried about ratings, and neither should you, especially people foolishly believing that inserting an already over-saturated series that could easily go to the competition in a couple of years. The idea of putting that show in the middle of an action block is self-destructive, moronic, inane, nonsensical, farfetched, and stupid as hell.

Oh, and don't worry about stuff that's not even airing at the same time as Toonami on broadcast TV. Saturday Night Live wins every time. They've been on since 1975, and they've ruled Saturday late nights just as long.

You have absolutely NO clue what you're talking about when it comes to ratings. Period. lol When you started your post off by saying "Ratings, in the long run, don't matter." I couldn't stop laughing. You rambled on in your post making yourself look very uninformed about the subject when you tried to make yourself seem knowledgeable about it. EVEN the end of your post "Oh, and don't worry about stuff that's not even airing at the same time as Toonami on broadcast TV. Saturday Night Live wins every time. They've been on since 1975, and they've ruled Saturday late nights just as long". HOW ABOUT NO. When Madtv was airing both shows were at war and of course Madtv was the funnier show but in the end they decided to CANCEL the show because their favorite cast members wanted to move on to doing movies/tv etc and the ratings were LOW because the best cast members were leaving. Ratings = MONEY. T.v. is about RATINGS. PERIOD. Don't try to misinform people about the subject of "ratings". I'm going to ignore the "family guy" argument because it's the most ridiculous thing I've read about toonami lol.

 

[RabidInuyashaFan]

A 27% drop from a premiere is a waste of space in that time slot. The 1m nights are ancient history. That's nostalgia for you. That's why a poorly written & poorly drawn GXP drew well over 800k before Naruto arrived. When the writing & art don't hold up nostalgia value only lasts for so long. Clearly it's held up well for FG. E7 is a boring show that was routinely beaten by GXP until George & Rei showed up. It's no mystery then that GXP is beating it again since they've died. Both TC & ST have crappy conclusions, but ST's is worse. Crappy conclusions = poor repeat value & the ratings prove that.

---

The truth hurts & I get that. Sure there will be some fanatics that will be angry if FG were to appear at 2:30a but they will be overshadowed by those that welcome the change. That will be true both in the TV & social media ratings & quite frankly social media is driven as much by hate as love. Just look at how much hate the mere suggestion that FG should be appreciated for it's animated action has drawn. Others will grow an appreciation for it as I have. FG has been accepted everywhere else (TBS, [as], synd) so odds are great it will be on Toonami as well. Whether it happens comes down to expectations. I've made that clear. As long as both advertisers & [as] are content with the LLN ratings, it won't.

 

[Light Lucario]

I'm a Toonami fan & I would welcome select ep of FG & SC from 2:30-3:30. That's how easy it is to refute childish posts that include exagerated claims as "no fan wants it." Next I'll probably read something stupid like "you're not a Toonami fan because you want it." I can't believe someone is so ???? enough to compare Hamtaro to FamGuy. Why even bother to post such drivel in a Toonami ratings thread? If you don't think ratings are all that important then why bother posting here? I guess you're just a moth drawn to the flame. The ratings prove that TC, ST, & E7 are nothing but wastes of space in the lineup now so I'm looking forward to their exits. I'd rather see War of Geminar follow IGPX than the continuation of these tiresome relics.

---

I didn't rule out OP on a Nick network because obviously it comes down to price. If the price is right they would gladly take on OP. Nick decided original YGO & Zexal were better buys instead.

I'd rather not see another Tenchi series after what I saw of GPX on the block. I'd prefer seeing something different that will hopefully be good. I don't think that Nickelodeon would be that interested in One Piece. Most of, if not all of, the anime that they have picked up in recent years are from an established franchise that has been popular. One Piece hasn't been as popular as DBZ or Yu-Gi-Oh! in the U.S., so I doubt that they would have been that interested in it.

A 27% drop from a premiere is a waste of space in that time slot. The 1m nights are ancient history. That's nostalgia for you. That's why I poorly written & poorly drawn GXP drew well over 800k before Naruto arrived. When the writing & art don't hold up nostalgia value only last for so long. Clearly it's held up well for FG. E7 is a boring show that was routinely beaten by GXP until George & Rei showed up. It's no mystery then that GXP is beating it again since they've died. Both TC & ST have crappy conclusions, but ST's is worse. Crappy conclusions = poor repeat value & the ratings prove that.

I agree that Eureka 7 is boring, but being beaten by GXP when it didn't do well the first time it aired and GXP is airing new episodes, I still don't think that really means a lot. I actually thought that Sym-Bionic Titan had a good conclusion. It didn't resolve its storyline and it worked better as a season finale, rather than a series finale, but I thought it ended the series on a hopeful note. Thundercat's conclusion wasn't as satisfying though. Sym-Bionic Titan didn't have a lot of strong ratings even during its first run and Thundercats' ratings dipped near the end of its first run too, but I don't think I'd consider them a waste of space. They do provide a bit of diversity with the lineup with having a couple of Western animated shows and since they don't have to pay to air them, it probably saves them a bit of money to use for other shows. Moving them to the later hours of the block, as they plan to do, is a fine way to handle these shows in their second runs.

 

[Spideyzilla]

OK.... look. I've been gone for awhile (Hey guys, btw) but I've been looking at this thread and my only reaction is huh? What? This is so unprofessional and so uncool as whole. I'm just hearing people belittling others and saying other people's opinions are crap. This is so clearly getting out of hand. Look, I don't get AS and so I don't watch Toonami, so the ratings are of no consequence to me. But other people do, and I get that. But I can say this is not how people discuss. Here: Toonami clearly doesn't want Family Guy. From I know of Toonami it's not a good fit. There you go. MOVE ON. Talk about the ratings. Or if not, just listen to the penguin below.

 

[HG Revolution]

And from all indications they are content with them.

 

[voicerocker]

A 27% drop from a premiere is a waste of space in that time slot. The 1m nights are ancient history. That's nostalgia for you. That's why a poorly written & poorly drawn GXP drew well over 800k before Naruto arrived. When the writing & art don't hold up nostalgia value only lasts for so long. Clearly it's held up well for FG. E7 is a boring show that was routinely beaten by GXP until George & Rei showed up. It's no mystery then that GXP is beating it again since they've died. Both TC & ST have crappy conclusions, but ST's is worse. Crappy conclusions = poor repeat value & the ratings prove that.

---

The truth hurts & I get that. Sure there will be some fanatics that will be angry if FG were to appear at 2:30a but they will be overshadowed by those that welcome the change. That will be true both in the TV & social media ratings & quite frankly social media is driven as much by hate as love. Others will grow an appreciation for FG's animated action as I have. FG has been accepted everywhere else (TBS, [as], synd) so odds are great it will be on Toonami as well. Whether it happens comes down to expectations. I've made that clear. As long as both advertisers & [as] are content with the LLN ratings, it won't.

Again, you ignore the main argument against Family Guy. It is NOT an action show and has no place on a block dedicated to action. Look at ALL the shows Toonami has ever run: List of programs broadcast by Toonami - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia You can NOT find any 1 show out of those that is anything like Family Guy. Even as bad as Wulin Warriors was, it was better suited for Toonami than Family Guy. And no, Peter vs. the chicken is not action. Anyone who thinks that fight is quality action along the lines of anything from Cowboy Bebop is lying to themselves.

I just checked the ratings for the past several months. Since GXP was moved to 3:00am, Eureka 7 has beaten it 9 times, while GXP has beaten Eureka only 7 times. So currently, Eureka is doing better than GXP.

ThunderCats and Sym-Bionic Titan don't even have true conclusions. They were canceled by CN for reasons that can only be explained as "They didn't sell (enough) toys." Ratings for both of the shows were said to be good, so it wasn't due to people not watching, and the ratings for them on Toonami definitely have not reflected that either. ThunderCats may be losing steam now because it is rerunning, but it's only 1 episode into the rerun. FAR too early to jump to the conclusion that ThunderCats will flop in reruns. But they're moving it when One Piece starts, so ThunderCats won't even been an issue come May.

SOME "fanatics"? I can imagine a vast majority of Toonami fans would stop watching Toonami if Family Guy starts airing there. Why? Because it makes absolutely no sense for THAT show to air on THAT block. Since you're so confident in this idea, tell me this: Why isn't Family Guy already on Toonami if it's such a simple, guaranteed success? Because it's not. Family Guy works on stations airing comedy. (big surprise... -_-) but putting in the middle of the likes of ThunderCats, Soul Eater, IGPX, InuYasha, FMA Brotherhood and Bebop is a terrible, terrible decision. There's no guarantee that billing it as an action show would work. Just because it's "Family Guy" means nothing, especially considering I've heard FG fans say that the show has really gone down in quality. It would completely destroy everything that Toonami is about and would be a complete and total sellout.

 

[Jeff Harris]

Let me parse this post as much as I can:

"Nonsense. Ratings are all that matter ...past yr."

Are you a network executive? A programmer? An advertiser? A Nielsen household? If the answers to these questions are no, then guess what?

THEY JUST DON'T MATTER! You're not counted, at all. Sure, you read the ratings, kid, but you don't understand the true value of the number, how it's actually calculated, how skewed and misleading the Nielsen number is compared to the actual number, and the gravity of what these numbers really are, which is a joke.

"While it's true that a very small % of HH's are represented on a nightly basis it's wrong to say the rest of the homes don't matter at all. Nielsen ended pretty much all criticisms when they agreed to collect set top data from providers on a nightly basis as a form of quality assurance for their in-house representation."

Households. Say. HOUSEHOLDS. And no, it's not wrong to say the rest of the households don't matter at all. The Nielsen folk will kindly and politely say that their ratings are culled from a small sampling that represents an entire community (fact: in my hometown, there are 5 Nielsen households, and all of them are concentrated in more affluent households), but the truth is one house doesn't really represent the viewing habits of 60,000 households. One household equals one set in one house. THAT'S IT! Nielsen doesn't even account for multiple television sets per house, just one main set connected to one meter. And it's usually the main family set in the family room/den/living room.

Skipping past a bunch of gibberish:

"OP failed on CN & the WB/CW in yrs past because neither it's chars nor storyline appealed enough to kids. That's why Nick never pulled the trigger to bring it to their networks."

Okay, One Piece never aired on The WB/The CW, just Fox. It had high ratings each and every week it was on, number 2 behind TMNT every week if memory recalls. One Piece didn't "fail" on Cartoon Network because kids didn't connect to it. It failed because they were repeats of a poorly-edited version of a series that aired months ago and kids were watching the usual live-action pablum on Nickelodeon on Saturday nights. It also failed because it was only on once a week, which didn't help at all. Naruto did better because, unlike One Piece, it was actually new episodes. This is not conjecture. These are facts.

Nickelodeon didn't pick it up because they felt Dragon Ball Z Kai was a fresher draw for them while One Piece, which is still in production, is a costlier one. Also, One Piece, which has a much smaller fanbase compared to Dragon Ball Z in the US, was more expensive with its large, growing number of episodes, and Nick's not going to spend that much money on a series they don't own outright. Yu-Gi-Oh is cheaper by a country mile mostly because its backed by a mass merchandising push of cards and games which continue to sell in this country. Again, not conjecture. These are facts.

Cartoon Network/Adult Swim has gone FAR beyond what many of us could have imagined in regards to Toonami, picking up more shows than you could think of while maintaining a consistent viewership. Like I said, you can't really compare the performance of Saturday and the rest of the week without acknowledging the variables that exist. Toonami's doing way better than armchair quarterbacks whining about ratings they don't understand and trolling about inappropriate shows in the middle of the block give them credit for. Stop worrying about things you can't control nor understand.

It'll make you saner.

 

[Snowballx]

Let me parse this post as much as I can:

"Nonsense. Ratings are all that matter ...past yr."

Are you a network executive? A programmer? An advertiser? A Nielsen household? If the answers to these questions are no, then guess what?

THEY JUST DON'T MATTER! You're not counted, at all. Sure, you read the ratings, kid, but you don't understand the true value of the number, how it's actually calculated, how skewed and misleading the Nielsen number is compared to the actual number, and the gravity of what these numbers really are, which is a joke.

"While it's true that a very small % of HH's are represented on a nightly basis it's wrong to say the rest of the homes don't matter at all. Nielsen ended pretty much all criticisms when they agreed to collect set top data from providers on a nightly basis as a form of quality assurance for their in-house representation."

Households. Say. HOUSEHOLDS. And no, it's not wrong to say the rest of the households don't matter at all. The Nielsen folk will kindly and politely say that their ratings are culled from a small sampling that represents an entire community (fact: in my hometown, there are 5 Nielsen households, and all of them are concentrated in more affluent households), but the truth is one house doesn't really represent the viewing habits of 60,000 households. One household equals one set in one house. THAT'S IT! Nielsen doesn't even account for multiple television sets per house, just one main set connected to one meter. And it's usually the main family set in the family room/den/living room.

Skipping past a bunch of gibberish:

"OP failed on CN & the WB/CW in yrs past because neither it's chars nor storyline appealed enough to kids. That's why Nick never pulled the trigger to bring it to their networks."

Okay, One Piece never aired on The WB/The CW, just Fox. It had high ratings each and every week it was on, number 2 behind TMNT every week if memory recalls. One Piece didn't "fail" on Cartoon Network because kids didn't connect to it. It failed because they were repeats of a poorly-edited version of a series that aired months ago and kids were watching the usual live-action pablum on Nickelodeon on Saturday nights. It also failed because it was only on once a week, which didn't help at all. Naruto did better because, unlike One Piece, it was actually new episodes. This is not conjecture. These are facts.

Nickelodeon didn't pick it up because they felt Dragon Ball Z Kai was a fresher draw for them while One Piece, which is still in production, is a costlier one. Also, One Piece, which has a much smaller fanbase compared to Dragon Ball Z in the US, was more expensive with its large, growing number of episodes, and Nick's not going to spend that much money on a series they don't own outright. Yu-Gi-Oh is cheaper by a country mile mostly because its backed by a mass merchandising push of cards and games which continue to sell in this country. Again, not conjecture. These are facts.

Cartoon Network/Adult Swim has gone FAR beyond what many of us could have imagined in regards to Toonami, picking up more shows than you could think of while maintaining a consistent viewership. Like I said, you can't really compare the performance of Saturday and the rest of the week without acknowledging the variables that exist. Toonami's doing way better than armchair quarterbacks whining about ratings they don't understand and trolling about inappropriate shows in the middle of the block give them credit for. Stop worrying about things you can't control nor understand.

It'll make you saner.

I work for an entertainment site and YES they do matter. The ratings don't only matter to people like in those parts of the industry. Also, I just wanted to state if dbz every came back to Toonami it would be a HUGE ratings hit for them because of the following it continues to have here in the states. I'm not even going to argue because you have no clue what you're talking about. Have a good day.

 

[RabidInuyashaFan]

It goes w/out saying with DBZ. But as long as Kai continues to air on NT & in syndication it's not going to appear on Toonami. Considering it's ratings on Vortexx, that's not going to end any time soon. But Toonami can certainly remain patient there because DBZ's value has held up for decades.

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I don't think people are stupid for disagreeing with me on FG at 2:30a in a Toonami block. It's clear from posts here that there are enough who see Toonami as a cult that is governed by a strong traditional sense. But I do think they are wastes of space when all they have to offer is name calling. That's not going to stop someone from vigorously defending their pov. That's only going to shift the tone in which they do it.

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I'm not surprised they would shout nonsense like "ratings don't matter" because that is at the crux of the debate. If ratings don't matter, then Toonami should focus more on drama for it's animated action because that's not only it's traditional sense but also ASAs. If ratings don't matter & Funimation is offering freebies like E7 than I would rather see more past anime from the industry's glory years than failed CN shows. But ratings do matter as they are the very lifeblood of the tv industry. So that's why DeMarco tapped CN nostalgia value as well as anime nostalgia value to fill out the lineup. Soul Eater is the most recent show on the block & it's not all that recent in terms of it's anime prod date.

 

[Raidon Makoto]

I work for an entertainment site and YES they do matter. The ratings don't only matter to people like in those parts of the industry. Also, I just wanted to state if dbz every came back to Toonami it would be a HUGE ratings hit for them because of the following it continues to have here in the states. I'm not even going to argue because you have no clue what you're talking about. Have a good day.

Sir, you literally have no ethos. You are arguing with Jeff Harris, literally THE GUY who has exactly a clue about what he's talking about. Not only does Jeff also run his own entertainment site (The X Bridge), but its been up for more than ten years. The dude named a television network in England, for Pete's sake. To come here (The X Bridge's official forum -- basically Jeff's homecourt) and tell him that he knows nothing only makes you look like you know nothing about what you're talking about.